Loved this interview but have a weird request: whenever you have an interview, can you also embed an audio only version/player? I very very infrequently care to watch an interview and the Substack video player SUCKS for just listening while using my phone for other things.
Also, not a Derek thing at all, but Substack has got to do something about how clicking on a post with an embedded video just automatically starts playing the audio. I cannot stress enough how much I NEVER want any app to do this.
Derek- I listened to you talk with Emily last night, and that was great. I remember reading somewhere that the pandemic transformed American attitudes toward strangers- they went from being OK with them, to being concerned that they were threats. Perhaps we are still living in this shadow- 5 years on. It's connected to your point about circles- we have tightened our core and built parasocial relationships with people we have never met- so that middle that could include people IRL has been hollowed.
It always seemed strange to be that K-12 is so fixated on reading and writing without ever showing kids how to have reciprocal, generative conversations. I can imagine a scenario we’re AI chatbots incentivize a renaissance of orality — and another where we retreat to engaging with robots on devices.
Similarly, I wonder if listening to podcasts of talented conversationalists — like you and Ezra — strengthens or weakens the conversation capabilities of listeners.
Speaking of podcasts, would you be willing to turn on the podcast feed so we can take the audio with us?
> But some questions are really dead ends. Like one that comes up weirdly often in introductory conversations is, “So, got any siblings?” People are like: Yes. One. And it's like … Alright? It's not clear what to say to that.
I think the person who says "Yes, one" and stops is failing as a conversationalist. They are being too literal. The question invites you to talk about your siblings.
Asking "Are you close with your family?" is somewhat loaded. I'm not saying it's a total faux pas, but it's probably better to invite someone to talk about their family in a more open-ended way. Like asking about siblings.
One of the greatest skills I learned in writing a book was cold outreach journalism. Going into a place and just figuring out how to talk to people and engage them. Super hard but super valuable.
I think of this quote and find it “freeing”: “You can be the ripest, juiciest peach in the world, and there's still going to be somebody who hates peaches.” I don’t spend a lot of time worrying if people like me. 🤣. I always tell my kids - you can learn something from everyone you meet! Interesting that the top quartile of earners had the lowest decline in face to face socialization?? I wonder what’s about.
My final year of college, I read Epley's "Mistakenly Seeking Solitude" paper and decided to run an experiment for my senior psychology thesis: would people enjoy having deep conversations with strangers?
Unsurprisingly, people generally thought they would prefer discussing shallower topics with strangers but actually ended up preferring the more meaningful topics.
The academic work was partially facilitated through my "startup", Project Conversation. (I never got around to branding...) Instead of hosting conversations in a lab where participants would be observed, I got a few dozen students to sign up online and meet strangers somewhere on campus. Part of the idea was to see if technology could close the intention-action gap: it's intimidating to strike up a deep conversation with a stranger, but perhaps easier to have a double opt-in (this was just as dating apps started to really take off).
I gave up the project when I graduated but have maintained a somewhat dormant interest in social technology since. Thanks to your writing on The Anti-Social Century and conversations like these, I can feel the spark to do something coming back.
“The causes for this social collapse are complex and diverse.”
This has the same energy as this-meeting-could-have-been-an-email. This isn’t “complex”. It’s just the new fully remote and hybrid corp. operating models.
Apologies for posting twice, but I saw you had a live chat with someone else last night. I missed it, is that going to be posted anywhere to listen to later?
Loved this interview but have a weird request: whenever you have an interview, can you also embed an audio only version/player? I very very infrequently care to watch an interview and the Substack video player SUCKS for just listening while using my phone for other things.
Also, not a Derek thing at all, but Substack has got to do something about how clicking on a post with an embedded video just automatically starts playing the audio. I cannot stress enough how much I NEVER want any app to do this.
Derek- I listened to you talk with Emily last night, and that was great. I remember reading somewhere that the pandemic transformed American attitudes toward strangers- they went from being OK with them, to being concerned that they were threats. Perhaps we are still living in this shadow- 5 years on. It's connected to your point about circles- we have tightened our core and built parasocial relationships with people we have never met- so that middle that could include people IRL has been hollowed.
Great conversation. I like your style, Derek!
It always seemed strange to be that K-12 is so fixated on reading and writing without ever showing kids how to have reciprocal, generative conversations. I can imagine a scenario we’re AI chatbots incentivize a renaissance of orality — and another where we retreat to engaging with robots on devices.
Similarly, I wonder if listening to podcasts of talented conversationalists — like you and Ezra — strengthens or weakens the conversation capabilities of listeners.
Speaking of podcasts, would you be willing to turn on the podcast feed so we can take the audio with us?
Leaves this video knowing I need to ask better questions!
Thank you for this fascinating live-stream! I love your work, particularly Abundance. I'd love to talk more.
Keep having quality conversations like these please! They enrich our society!
> But some questions are really dead ends. Like one that comes up weirdly often in introductory conversations is, “So, got any siblings?” People are like: Yes. One. And it's like … Alright? It's not clear what to say to that.
I think the person who says "Yes, one" and stops is failing as a conversationalist. They are being too literal. The question invites you to talk about your siblings.
Asking "Are you close with your family?" is somewhat loaded. I'm not saying it's a total faux pas, but it's probably better to invite someone to talk about their family in a more open-ended way. Like asking about siblings.
One of the greatest skills I learned in writing a book was cold outreach journalism. Going into a place and just figuring out how to talk to people and engage them. Super hard but super valuable.
I think of this quote and find it “freeing”: “You can be the ripest, juiciest peach in the world, and there's still going to be somebody who hates peaches.” I don’t spend a lot of time worrying if people like me. 🤣. I always tell my kids - you can learn something from everyone you meet! Interesting that the top quartile of earners had the lowest decline in face to face socialization?? I wonder what’s about.
The "did you look up your sister" typo really threw me off. But I love the concept of doorknobs, so it was overall worth it!
Grabbing a doorknob here myself:
My final year of college, I read Epley's "Mistakenly Seeking Solitude" paper and decided to run an experiment for my senior psychology thesis: would people enjoy having deep conversations with strangers?
Unsurprisingly, people generally thought they would prefer discussing shallower topics with strangers but actually ended up preferring the more meaningful topics.
The academic work was partially facilitated through my "startup", Project Conversation. (I never got around to branding...) Instead of hosting conversations in a lab where participants would be observed, I got a few dozen students to sign up online and meet strangers somewhere on campus. Part of the idea was to see if technology could close the intention-action gap: it's intimidating to strike up a deep conversation with a stranger, but perhaps easier to have a double opt-in (this was just as dating apps started to really take off).
I gave up the project when I graduated but have maintained a somewhat dormant interest in social technology since. Thanks to your writing on The Anti-Social Century and conversations like these, I can feel the spark to do something coming back.
“The causes for this social collapse are complex and diverse.”
This has the same energy as this-meeting-could-have-been-an-email. This isn’t “complex”. It’s just the new fully remote and hybrid corp. operating models.
Apologies for posting twice, but I saw you had a live chat with someone else last night. I missed it, is that going to be posted anywhere to listen to later?
Very interesting. Thanks.
Interesting read